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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
The M4 Sherman
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
Armorama: 2,804 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 07:59 AM UTC
I was very pleased to read the email of the upcoming M4 retrospective!!! FSM's Feb 2002 issue is about the Sherman too.
Anyway, I have a Tamiya M4 early version just beckoning me to start it. I've been sitting on this kit so I could hone my skills, because I want to do a great job on it.
Now with all the info on the Sherman what the heck is a guy to do?? I would like to do it as an early version and was wondering if anyone has done the Tamiya kit? Is it good out of the box or should I look for after-market pieces to make it more accurate?
I look forward to the retro. Arrrgggghhhhh
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 09:49 AM UTC
Don't get bent out of shape trying to get the rivets right. This kit is heavily based on the M4A3 with some new sprues added. It is a good kit right out of the box. In fact, I just bought one. The only thing I truly recommend for a Tamiya Sherman kit is to "blank" off the underside of the upper hull sponsons with sheet styrene. This way you can't see through the hatches and onto the top of the tracks.
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
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Posted: Sunday, December 30, 2001 - 10:28 AM UTC
I will fill those holes. Thanks. Is the kit a "true" early version, or are there parts that need to be back-dated?
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Monday, December 31, 2001 - 03:33 AM UTC
I will have to look at the kit carefully. As I said, I just bought it for $30 at my local hobby shop. I got it since it was on sale and since the DML kit I have has been going for $60+ on eBay, I'd rather build a $30 kit and save the DML M4A1 for later.

In other news, Squadron had the "new" M4A3 as their subscriber special for only $24.99 that I ordered. Will be interesting to compare the three unbuilt Tamiya Sherman's that I currently have.
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2001 - 04:24 AM UTC
Rob, please keep me posted on your opinion of all three kits when you get a chance. Would love to hear a side by side comparison.
Thanks. :-)
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Monday, December 31, 2001 - 04:47 AM UTC
Sure will, plus my Feb 2002 FSM just came in today's mail, woohoo! Now I just need the mailman to send the new M4A3.

Quality reading time tonight!
generalzod
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United States
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 3,172 posts
Armorama: 2,495 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 07:14 AM UTC
Hi I just bought the new Tamiya M4A3 It has a new decal sheet,3 winter infantry figs,new tc and has the solid dish road wheels-no detail on the inside Also has the t-48 tracks and a lot of accessories 6AD decals not a bad kit
Kencelot
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Joined: December 27, 2001
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 08:55 AM UTC
Thats the one my wife bought me for my b-day! Looks good eh?! Can't wait another 2 weeks! Shhh! she doesnt know I know...yeah right.
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2002 - 10:13 AM UTC
Speaking of the new Tamiya kit, I see a winter camo paint job. Has anyone attempted to do a winter camo on any models? If so, how did you go about it? Reason being, is I want to do a "Battle of the Bulge" dio, my first in many years, and all the photos I've seen of that battle, the AFV's that did sport a winter camo, look like they were painted on with whatever the crews could get their hands on. Old brushes, leaves, rags, who knows?
How could I go about duplicating a haphazard painting? Any clues or ideas?
Chief
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Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2002
KitMaker: 496 posts
Armorama: 193 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 11:14 AM UTC
Need opinions (ya right!)
1) I bought a Nichimo M4A1 Kit No. DT3501 way back in 97 in Germany and just now got the M4 itch. How accurate is this kit? I know I have to plug alot of holes etc. and change the drive sprocket housings, but what else? The FSM issues on the Sherman is to blame and have bought a few after market parts.

2) Anybody back-date an Italeri M4A1 to the real early version (75mm dry w/3 piece tranny cover and m34 manlet etc.) If so, what did you do to pull it off?

3)I am looking for DML M4A1 anybody got one or put me in right direction??? Aint payin $75 on ebay either!

Thanks for listening!
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 11:51 AM UTC

Quoted Text

1) I bought a Nichimo M4A1 Kit No. DT3501 way back in 97 in Germany and just now got the M4 itch. How accurate is this kit? I know I have to plug alot of holes etc. and change the drive sprocket housings, but what else?

The road wheels could stand to be replaced and the VVSS needs to be a little better detailed. The barrel suffers and could use some work or an aluminum barrel (waste of money for this kit though). Overall surface detail is soft and a PE set would dress it up a bit (again, sinking that kind of money into the kit is a waste). Tracks are made more for the motorization of the kit than accuracy. They may have end connectors that don't connect track blocks, I'm not sure where mine is to take a look at.


Quoted Text

2) Anybody back-date an Italeri M4A1 to the real early version (75mm dry w/3 piece tranny cover and m34 manlet etc.) If so, what did you do to pull it off?

I believe I used the Verlinden turret (or was it just the mantlet?) to replace the Italeri one. If it was just the mantlet, then I used the Tamiya M4A3 turret and filled in the loader's hatch. Been over 13 years since I did the conversion and the tank has been in a box for at least the last 11 years.


Quoted Text

3)I am looking for DML M4A1 anybody got one or put me in right direction??? Aint payin $75 on ebay either!

I got one, and I ain't selling it either. Word on the street is that it is being reissued. Good buy, comes with a lot of extra parts for the Sherman, but the reissue may have some of the plastic removed. This was one of my first DML/Dragon kits and I was surprised with the amount of extra parts they left in the kits.
Bombshell
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New York, United States
Joined: January 22, 2002
KitMaker: 293 posts
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Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 11:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Speaking of the new Tamiya kit, I see a winter camo paint job. Has anyone attempted to do a winter camo on any models? If so, how did you go about it?


Quoted Text

How could I go about duplicating a haphazard painting? Any clues or ideas?



Here is an idea. Get some classroom chalk, the white one of course, ground it up and mix it with some water and dishwashing soap. Apply over the kit's surface with a wide brush. keep in mind that the final clear coat will fade the affect a little, so just go a little over what you want. If you make any mistake, water will get that stuff right out, very easy and clean. The advantage of this is, as you said, it gives the white wash a very depleted look. Hope this helps and good luck.

~~~and thats the story!

BTW: I just sent Modeling Madness an article on a out the box built on Tamiya's M4 early prod. Hope that helps also :-)
Bluefalcon47
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Netherlands
Joined: December 01, 2001
KitMaker: 255 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 06:10 PM UTC
Bombshell,
you forgot to mention that you have to paint the model normally, i.e. OD for a Sherman and then apply the chalk sludge. Overapply a little, then when dry remove the excess with a dry brush to achieve the faded look. Haven't tried it yet, but am about to on a Tamiya T-34/76 model 1942 (yes, the bad one, so if it doesn't work, I can just toss it in the trash LOL).
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
Armorama: 2,804 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 08:31 PM UTC
Bombshell, that Modeling Madness is a pretty cool site, although I didn't find M4 article. A site dedicated to kit reviews...who'd a thought! :-)

I think I'll give the chalk method a go on a scap model first to see the results. I just stripped and repainted the M4 yesterday, because I wasn't happy with the results from ABing white paint...it looked a little "blue" to me.
Thanks Bombshell, thanks David.

Always learning... :-)
Bombshell
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New York, United States
Joined: January 22, 2002
KitMaker: 293 posts
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Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 10:33 PM UTC
Hey Kencelot,

The M4 article will be posted sometime on the end of this week or beginning of next; and yes, that is one great website for reviews. I just wish they had more armor there. I guess its up to us to show them the way. Good luck on your built!

~~~and thats the story!
Chief
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Washington, United States
Joined: February 07, 2002
KitMaker: 496 posts
Armorama: 193 posts
Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 03:54 AM UTC
Sabot,

You mention a PE kit to dress up the Nichimo M4A1 kit, which one(s) are you referring to and where can I get it? I have collected a barrel, manlet, new tracks, new VVSS units and some brass tools, gun barrel and .30 cal mg. I been picking stuff up here & there so it doesn't seem like I spent too much, I just won't go back and add it all up!
TreadHead
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Colorado, United States
Joined: January 12, 2002
KitMaker: 5,000 posts
Armorama: 2,868 posts
Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 04:27 AM UTC
Hey all, got a Sherman question. Just bought the new release Italeri US Marines M4 Sherman at the local hobby store. It's designed to be a PTO Sherman, but it has the wading trunks (mainly the reason I bought it). I've been thinking about a' Band of Brothers' kind of dio where the paratroopers have jumped up on a couple of D-Day Shermans hitching a ride inland on a dirt road. How much work would it be to accurize the new release Italeri kit? Simple as just dropping the side boards?.....din't think so.
Any help would be appreciated :-)

Tread.

Always
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 04:36 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Simple as just dropping the side boards?.....din't think so.

Right, the PTO M4 kit is basically an M4A3 with parts added to kinda-sorta make it look like an M4A2. All D-Day tanks were M4 earlies. Take a look at Tamiya's M4 or Nichimo's M4. You will notice the difference in the front slope, just prior to the driver's hatches. On the M4Asomething this slope is flat, but on the early M4 there is a bulge right in front of where the driver and assistant driver's hatches are. Additionally, the boogies have a trailing support roller (the support roller is offset towards the back of the tank). On early M4s the support roller is centered directly above the boogies. Early M4s also do not have a loader's hatch.

But if you want to do it, go ahead, unless you plan on showing it, just build for yourself.
TreadHead
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Joined: January 12, 2002
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Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 05:02 AM UTC
Many, many thx for 'puttin me right' Rob. But unfortunately I'm the type of person that couldn't build it knowing it's wrong. I guess it's one of the things I'm a little 'anal' about.
Sooooo, I guess I'll just have to spring for an M4A1 and.......wait. Do you think I can use the Italeri wading trunks on the Tamiya or DML kit?? Actually how much inter-tradeability (is that a word?) is there between manufacturers??
I guess I'm just lazy and don't want to have to build the trunks out of sheet

Tread.

TreadHead
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Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 05:22 AM UTC
Anybody remember the scene in ' Band of Brothers' I'm talking about?
Kencelot
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Florida, United States
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
Armorama: 2,804 posts
Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 07:20 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Anybody remember the scene in ' Band of Brothers' I'm talking about?



Absolutely...like it was yesterday!

...and since you are going to get an M4A1...with just a little bit of "fixing" you could get the wading trunks from Italeri to fit any of the other kits.
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,587 posts
Armorama: 9,062 posts
Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 08:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

You mention a PE kit to dress up the Nichimo M4A1 kit, which one(s) are you referring to and where can I get it?

There is the old Verlinden Sherman Super Detail set VP3 263 has a lot of generic details originally designed for the Nichimo M4/Tamiya M4A3/Italeri M4A1, when they were the only game in town. Eduard also makes an M4 set (for the Tamiya kit) and On-The-Mark makes a Sherman set too.
TreadHead
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Colorado, United States
Joined: January 12, 2002
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Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 10:11 AM UTC
Many thx Kenc' with regard to the wading trunks fitting the Italeri kit . Guess I'll figure it out.
Glad you remember that scene in Band of Brothers. I just loved that show. I hadn't found this site back then and hung around the HBO/BOB official site DG. Did you guys talk about the show back then? Did Armorama.com exist then?

Tread.

Always
RufusLeeking
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Ohio, United States
Joined: January 18, 2002
KitMaker: 330 posts
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Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 10:20 AM UTC
Hey Tread,
It was a great mini series, hope it comes out on DVD too, would make a great Christmas present. (Hopes wife is reading this too). I also read the boook twice. I don't remember the scene you mentioned, I do remember them on tanks in Holland, but my mind is not what it used to be.

Ron C.
Ashtabula, Oh
RufusLeeking
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Ohio, United States
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Posted: Monday, February 25, 2002 - 10:32 AM UTC
Also Ken and Tread I would really like to hear what you guys think of those two kits. I've been thinking about getting both of them and would like your input when you get a chance.

Tanks again,
Ron C.
Ashtabula, Oh