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Armor/AFV: Large Scale
1/16 and Larger Armor Modeling
Hosted by Darren Baker
Panther G Late with steel wheels/late mantlet
Darius359au
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: May 30, 2018
KitMaker: 24 posts
Armorama: 24 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 - 12:28 PM UTC
I was going to get the Trumpeter 1/16 Panther G early as my next project ,(just finished the 1/16 T34/85 factory 183),but Trumpeter announced and have just released a Panther G Late with nightvision so I decided I'll build that , but I've noticed a problem with it - on the box art and the sprues ive seen online it got steel road wheels with the chinned mantlet!

I know MAN built something like 22 panther G early's with steel wheels but I've never seen or been able to find images of a late with them , does anyone know of any pictures or references of a late with steel wheels,(I know about the handful that had steel wheels for the last set of wheels but that it).

I'd like to build the late but the steel wheels would niggle me ,even though no one else I know would know the difference
Cuny12
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Australia
Joined: April 04, 2010
KitMaker: 378 posts
Armorama: 348 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 - 01:05 PM UTC
Hi mate

Iíve built the early and Iím thinking given the early kit had the late parts minus the crew heater you should be able to add delete parts as needed to create the tank you are trying to make.

Iím getting another early and swapping the wheels between the two kits to make what I want those being an Ardennes steel wheel and a Late production panther G with last wheel station steel wheel.

Hope that helped mate.
d111298pw
#456
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Delhi, India / भारत
Joined: September 22, 2016
KitMaker: 652 posts
Armorama: 636 posts
Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 - 05:33 PM UTC
The 800mm steel roadwheels were trialed on Ausf. G's SN 121032 to 121055 (confirmed). In addition, MAN installed a single steel roadwheel on the last station on an unknown number of late Ausf. G's in 1945. The reason is unknown, but, both configurations were coming off the line at MAN at the end of the war.

As far as timelines go, the "chin" mantlet drawings were released to production in Sept 1944. So, in theory, it is possible the first production "chin" mantlet could have been installed on one of the 23 steel roadwheel Ausf. G's.

I haven't seen a pic of that configuration, but that doesn't mean it didn't exist. You might also have had a field repair/replacement where this configuration was installed.
TopSmith
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Washington, United States
Joined: August 09, 2002
KitMaker: 1,625 posts
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Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 - 11:50 PM UTC
Worst case you could grind down the chin and lightly stipple the mantlet.

Darius359au
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: May 30, 2018
KitMaker: 24 posts
Armorama: 24 posts
Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 12:31 AM UTC
kit comes with both the early and late mantlets but now I'm really conflicted because I found this after some deep google fu ,is what looks like a a late G with heater , steel wheels and a round early mantlet...


Oh and even more strange is a steel wheeled G with the first road wheel after the drive sprocket replaced with a normal rubber tyred road wheel

TopSmith
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Washington, United States
Joined: August 09, 2002
KitMaker: 1,625 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 12:36 AM UTC
Food for thought. Each model of a German tank is not what you think it is. From what I have read, when a new model or update comes out, they didn't throw out the older parts at the factory. They phased in parts as they used up old supplies so there would be overlaps from one model to the next.
Darius359au
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: May 30, 2018
KitMaker: 24 posts
Armorama: 24 posts
Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 12:38 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Food for thought. Each model of a German tank is not what you think it is. From what I have read, when a new model or update comes out, they didn't throw out the older parts at the factory. They phased in parts as they used up old supplies so there would be overlaps from one model to the next.



Seems that way with the new images I've found..
Cuny12
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Australia
Joined: April 04, 2010
KitMaker: 378 posts
Armorama: 348 posts
Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 01:45 AM UTC
Find a pic of a Tank that Appeals to you then go from there.

Iíve honestly given up on the whole it must have these features with this and that as someone always comes along that owns this titled book and tells you itís not right as heís not really a modeller but a book reader.

One thing for certain is that German Tank factories were nothing like Lima Ohio refitting or producing Armoured vehicles.
alanmac
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United Kingdom
Joined: February 25, 2007
KitMaker: 3,018 posts
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 02:04 AM UTC
Hi

Was night vision actually fitted and used or was it something in the process of being developed but then Germany surrendered?

Alan


d111298pw
#456
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Delhi, India / भारत
Joined: September 22, 2016
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 03:23 AM UTC
Both styles of mantlets were installed up to the end of the war.
Bonaparte84
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Hessen, Germany
Joined: July 17, 2013
KitMaker: 325 posts
Armorama: 318 posts
Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 05:39 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi

Was night vision actually fitted and used or was it something in the process of being developed but then Germany surrendered?

Alan




SLightly off-topic, But I'll answer anyway.

The German infrared devices saw limited use with Panther units, check here:

http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/en/sdkfz-171-pzkpfwg-panther/technik/infrarotausstattung

Further, there was some limited use of the infantry nightvision equipment "Vampir".


Best,
Nicolas
alanmac
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United Kingdom
Joined: February 25, 2007
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Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 10:09 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Hi

Was night vision actually fitted and used or was it something in the process of being developed but then Germany surrendered?

Alan




SLightly off-topic, But I'll answer anyway.

The German infrared devices saw limited use with Panther units, check here:

http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/en/sdkfz-171-pzkpfwg-panther/technik/infrarotausstattung

Further, there was some limited use of the infantry nightvision equipment "Vampir".


Best,
Nicolas



Hi.

Thanks for your reply.

Going to the web site you linked to it states that

"From the production at MNH it is known that in August 1944 the Panthers should be equipped with the F.G. 1250 already ex works. Due to delays in delivery with the Fahrgeršt only 20 Panthers could be fitted out by October 1944. In November 1944 OKH issued an order stating that all panthers that had been fitted with the IR devices up to that point should have them removed and be converted back to standard Ausf G panthers."

So, whilst the equipment existed, was tested etc it never actually got fitted to combat Panthers and never saw "active service"
Bonaparte84
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Hessen, Germany
Joined: July 17, 2013
KitMaker: 325 posts
Armorama: 318 posts
Posted: Monday, July 01, 2019 - 07:24 PM UTC
MNH is only one of the manufacturers, and also, the 20 vehicles mentioned in said paragraph do not match the overall number of vehicles issued with the equipment.