login   |    register
Campaigns: Remember Market Garden (RMG)
This campaign group is for Operation: Remember Market Garden
Hosted by Richard S.
Out of The Box Questions and Answers
tsunami
Visit this Community
Pennsylvania, United States
Joined: January 02, 2004
KitMaker: 14 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, January 23, 2004 - 06:58 AM UTC
I know a lot of you have been asking questions about out of the box models. Out of the box is building a model straight out of the box with NO acceories. That means if you have a tamiya kit and they offer screens for that specific kit which don’t come in the original box that means you can not use them! Although where I come from you aloud to use putty to fill seams and cracks on the model. The question I have though is can you use different decals/markings? Contests I have entered in before allow you to do so. My other question is that sometimes instructions show how to do things not included in the kit such as: antennas, zimmerit and wiring is this aloud? Tamiya usually does it and show how to stretch sprue and putty. Thanks for reading and hopefully I have not stirred up a hornets nest. Good Luck to all the entrants!

-John
AJLaFleche
Visit this Community
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,074 posts
Armorama: 3,293 posts
Posted: Friday, January 23, 2004 - 07:19 AM UTC
From the official IPMS Competition Handbook:
"III. Special Categories
1. OUT-OF-THE-BOX entries will be governed by the following rules:
A. KITS. Any commercially available kit may be used. The number of categories incorporating Out-of-the-Box awards will be determined by the Host Chapter and the National Contest Committee.
B. FINISH. All finishing techniques are allowed. Decals other than those included with the kit may be used. Insignia, markings, and instrument panels may be hand-painted instead of decaled. Weathering is permitted.
C. CONSTRUCTION. The modeler may fill seams and gaps; sand off rivets; drill out gun ports, exhaust pipes, or other appropriate openings; thin to scale such parts as trailing edges, flaps, and doors; add rigging and antennas; and add simple tape or decal seat belts in the cockpit of an aircraft or the interior of a vehicle (NO commercial or modeler-manufactured hardware - e.g., buckles, etc.).
D. IT IS NOT PERMITTED TO: vacuform, manufacture, or replace any part, or substitute parts from another kit; cut or separate canopies, surfaces, hatches, doors, etc. (no major surgery); combine a standard kit with a conversion kit; add anything other than specified on the instruction sheet except as shown in Section C above.
INSTRUCTION SHEETS. Modelers must attach the kit instruction sheet to the entry form. Models entered without an attached kit instruction sheet will not be considered for an Out-of-the-Box award."


From my club's Out of Box Contest:
"In Brief: Any plastic model that is assembled as specified in the kit instructions is welcome in the competition.
In Detail:
The Kit:
1. The entry must be constructed from a SINGLE PLASTIC KIT available to the general public and must be essentially assembled as specified in the kit instructions. Only "Figures" may be non-plastic.
2. NO ADDITIONAL parts from any other kit or source may be added or substituted. Non-plastic pieces may be used if included in the kit.
3. PUTTY and scrap plastic may be used for repair and elimination of seams and mold marks. Putty and plastic may not be used to create new shapes.
4. The model may be PAINTED in any colors or patterns irrespective of the kit instructions or box art.
5. The modeler may add or substitute DECALS from one additional source (i.e., another kit or after-market decal sheet). This source must be listed on the entry form.
6. OPERATING FEATURES and motorization options may be deleted. Unrealistic holes or slots may be closed with sheet plastic and/or putty.
7. STRETCHED SPRUE may be added to the model only to represent Aerials or Antennas and/or for the repair of panel lines.
8. WEIGHT may be added for the purpose of balance. Structural reinforcement that is not visible to the casual observer is permissible.
9. Parts may not be RELOCATED from their intended position unless the kit instruction sheet is demonstrably in error. Judges may require documentation.
10. Panels, doors, hatches, flaps, canopies, etc. may not be CUT or opened unless the instruction sheet invites the cut as an option. However, drilling out of gun barrels, exhaust pipes, etc. is regarded as a basic skill and is permissible.
DISPLAY:
11. Human FIGURES and accessory equipment (such as fuel tanks, add-on weapons, in-car cameras, etc.) that are included in the kit may be used or discarded at the pleasure of the modeler.
12. Models may be displayed on a simple base. Also, name plates, spec. sheets, etc. are permitted as space allows (contestant's name must be obscured). The judges will not assign additional credit for these display materials."


In short, each club may define OOB as it sees fit and may require doucumentaion or not. If in doubt, give the contest contact a call or ask at head judge at the contest. Specific to your zimmerit question, when the instructions indicate the use of zim, as several Tamiya ones do, that would appear to be admissable.


Timlo
Visit this Community
Hong Kong S.A.R. / 繁體
Joined: November 02, 2003
KitMaker: 150 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, January 23, 2004 - 03:57 PM UTC
how about use the screens from Tamiya?
AJLaFleche
Visit this Community
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,074 posts
Armorama: 3,293 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 02:20 AM UTC

Quoted Text

how about use the screens from Tamiya?



No. They are considered aftermarket and would not be allowed. Now if Tamiya were pakage them in the box, that woould be a different story.
shonen_red
Visit this Community
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 02:53 AM UTC
How about adding threads as wires commonly found in Corsairs and other prop planes?
matt
Staff MemberCampaigns Administrator
Visit this Community
New York, United States
Joined: February 28, 2002
KitMaker: 5,940 posts
Armorama: 2,949 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 02:57 AM UTC
add rigging and antennas are allowed to be added
shonen_red
Visit this Community
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 03:09 AM UTC
Thanks!
SgtStriker
Visit this Community
Ontario, Canada
Joined: October 01, 2003
KitMaker: 29 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 11:34 AM UTC
Are you allowed to use two kits together, I have given up on my DC-3 and used the Tamiya Workmen set which comes with a Tiger Engine and i plan to put the engine into my tiger for the scene. Is that illegal?
AJLaFleche
Visit this Community
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,074 posts
Armorama: 3,293 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 04:43 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Are you allowed to use two kits together, I have given up on my DC-3 and used the Tamiya Workmen set which comes with a Tiger Engine and i plan to put the engine into my tiger for the scene. Is that illegal?



It's certainly not "illegal", the RCMP aren't going to be knocking down your door, but it is NOT out of the box by even the most liberal interpretation of the concept. If you plan on entering this in a contest as OOB the judges should recognize this as not OB and will not consider it as OOB for award purposes.

See "D" in th IPMS section above and #1 from my club's definition.

Rule of thumb: if the part didn't come in the original box you can not use it.
shonen_red
Visit this Community
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Friday, January 30, 2004 - 01:48 AM UTC
Another question regading threads, can we use threads to create the crosshair of certain aircraft weapons?
AJLaFleche
Visit this Community
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,074 posts
Armorama: 3,293 posts
Posted: Friday, January 30, 2004 - 04:42 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Another question regading threads, can we use threads to create the crosshair of certain aircraft weapons?



Unless the instructions indicated this as an option, I'd say no. For example, you could drill out the sights in a Flakvirling sight but you could not replace the plastic. If you were skilled enough to leave the original plastic in the form of the sight, that would be okay.
shonen_red
Visit this Community
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Monday, February 02, 2004 - 12:26 AM UTC
Are we allowed to paint the decal instead of using the waterslide one?
AJLaFleche
Visit this Community
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: May 05, 2002
KitMaker: 8,074 posts
Armorama: 3,293 posts
Posted: Monday, February 02, 2004 - 01:04 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Are we allowed to paint the decal instead of using the waterslide one?



Yes. SInce you're not adding anything (other than paint), you would be fre to do so. Also, you'd be free to do so under the concept of decals from any other source (our OOB requires documnetation of the source, the national rule does not).
shonen_red
Visit this Community
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 02:29 AM UTC
How about PE parts included in the box? Let's say Tamiya's T-72, Dragon Leopold and Hasegawa's BF-109E-4/7. They have PE parts included in the box.
WeWillHold
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: April 17, 2002
KitMaker: 2,314 posts
Armorama: 1,905 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 03:40 AM UTC

Quoted Text

How about PE parts included in the box? Let's say Tamiya's T-72, Dragon Leopold and Hasegawa's BF-109E-4/7. They have PE parts included in the box.



If they're in the box, they're oob.
Savage
Visit this Community
England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: June 04, 2003
KitMaker: 1,405 posts
Armorama: 656 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 09:25 AM UTC
How are Eduard's "Profipack" kits going to be addressed in competitions? There is no way these kits can be viewed as OOB.

The OOB section is usually where ‘Newbies’ get their first exposure to competitions. Now the Newbie’s Italeri 1/72 scale Messerschmitt Me 410 Hornisse @£6.25 (Truly OOB) is going to come up against an (Newbie or otherwise) Eduard Profipack Messerschmitt Me 410 Hornisse @£33.60 (OOB which includes resin and PE)

Don’t get me wrong I like Eduard’s Profipacks, but in a competition how can they be viewed as OOB?