login   |    register
Armor/AFV: IDF [Israeli Defense Forces]
Armor and AFVs of the IDF army from 1947-today.
Hosted by Darren Baker
Hobbyboss Merkava 4M with Trophy?@
cabasner
Visit this Community
Nevada, United States
Joined: February 12, 2012
KitMaker: 944 posts
Armorama: 897 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 05:36 AM UTC
Apparently, Hobbyboss is going to have a Merkava 4 with Trophy (84524 per Scalemates) coming out at some point. Competition for the Meng kit, obviously? Assuming this is true, does anyone have any insight as to whether Hobbyboss will have fixed the road wheel alignment issue they had with their older Merkava 4? That would be great news, if so. I was just getting back into modeling years back, and ended up buying the Hobbyboss Merkava 4 kit and a ton of aftermarket stuff for it (and spent a ton doing so; the Hobbyboss kit was a lot more than the Academy kit to begin with, not to mention all the expensive photoetch, etc), before I knew about the wheel alignment problem, and so never built it; rather, I got and built the Academy Merkava 4 LIC instead. If Hobbyboss fixed the alignment problem, I might get the 4M version, to see how it compares to Mengís version, and, if the parts would fit, Iíd order a replacement Ďtubí and finally build the Mark 4. I liked the Academy kit, but the Hobbyboss kit, despite the wheel issue and other inaccuracies, has more detail than the Academy kit, and I really would like to build it. I just donít have the wherewithall to do the surgery to fix the chassis and realign the wheels myself 😢. Any thoughts or knowledge on this?
Precious_rob
Visit this Community
United States
Joined: March 09, 2009
KitMaker: 206 posts
Armorama: 183 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 06:12 AM UTC
Personally Im not holding my breath on it them fixing the wheel alignment issue, just because nearly every single Merkava they have released has had alignment issue, even their 1/72 scale offerings.

And for, I have the Meng kit in my stash with the Desert Eagle battering ram and upgrade kit, so Im all set is it is
M4A1Sherman
Visit this Community
New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
Armorama: 3,876 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 06:30 AM UTC
Hi, People!

I'd like to build a 1/35 example of one of the very latest Merkavas- I'm lost at sea, here... Any advice besides "sort of" staying away from the HOBBY BOSS Merkava kits..?
system
Visit this Community
England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: November 24, 2008
KitMaker: 345 posts
Armorama: 344 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 07:37 AM UTC
It's funny how some kit problems get widely publicised with the online community, while others seem to go unnoticed. Conventional wisdom seems to be that the wheel alignment issue is the main issue with the Hobby Boss kit, which is otherwise pretty good.

But comparing the Hobby Boss Merkava 4 kit with the Desert Eagle books shows the kit is riddled with dimensional and detail problems, including: 'Squashed' suspension, inaccurate wheel spacing, sprocket with too many lightening holes, 'squashed' turret, inaccurate .50 cal mount etc. etc. etc. It's a highly-detailed mess.

Having said that, I could go for the new kit if they fix even half of these issues.

The Meng kit looks super-nice in the box; the Academy kit looks sharp and accurate, but a little simpler.
panzerbob01
Visit this Community
Louisiana, United States
Joined: March 06, 2010
KitMaker: 2,872 posts
Armorama: 2,703 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 07:46 AM UTC
Dennis;

IF you are looking to build a Mk. IV.... Folks seem pretty happy with the Meng IV w/ Trophy kit.

It offers some pretty good engineering and comes with that needed non-slip surface coating molded on. I'm considering going that kit myself, as I'm looking to build a IV and the Trophy version is pretty much the most-modern version available in a kit (FAIK), and the molded-on non-slip looks OK as seen in parts-pix and posted builds.

My build experience of Merk kits is Takom... I found the T's 2B kit to be pretty nice in all sorts of ways - good molding, good details, good parts-fit. Of course it does need that non-slip added on, and like most every other tank kit out there, it can stand a few added bits and pieces. IF Takom offered a late IV w/ Trophy kit, I would likely buy it, even if it lacks molded-on non-slip.

I THINK that I would consider one of HB's Mk II, and maybe HB's III LIC kits, but HB's other Merks I don't find compelling. Academy's kits look OK in the moldings, but the PE used to create the ball-n-chain drape is, well, not there for that important Merk feature. I know nada about how well the HB and Academy kits actually build.

Someone interested in actually capturing "all" of the major Merk features equally well will likely find that all of the kits desire some additions and mods. Of course, the AM market has risen to that occasion!

Just my opinion and 2c, of course!

Cheers! Bob
errains
#045
Visit this Community
South Carolina, United States
Joined: September 23, 2005
KitMaker: 293 posts
Armorama: 281 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 08:45 AM UTC
Hi Dennis...
As I'm currently building up the Meng Merk4m...It to me is a really nice piece of kit. Granted I just got rolling on it with the suspension and tracks. So far the only thing I don't like about the kit is how Meng engineered the tracks. They are divided top and bottom. Considering some of the slide molding that is in the kit not sure why it was done that way. And before someone says anything about "workable" tracks...just don't. Workable tracks for kits like this are just plan stupid (yep that's just my opinion). Other then the tracks the rest of the kit should build up nicely.
cabasner
Visit this Community
Nevada, United States
Joined: February 12, 2012
KitMaker: 944 posts
Armorama: 897 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 26, 2019 - 12:43 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi, People!

I'd like to build a 1/35 example of one of the very latest Merkavas- I'm lost at sea, here... Any advice besides "sort of" staying away from the HOBBY BOSS Merkava kits..?



Dennis,

Bob Woodman pretty much covered what I would say, but here are my own thoughts. I'm not sure what you meant by 'latest', whether you meant latest kits or latest real-life Merkava tanks. I'll assume you meant kits.

The early Merkavas, Mark I and Mark I Hybrid...Takom, absolutely! I've built the Mark I, and have the Hybrid, which I will build one day. The only other 1/35 scale I know of is the ancient Tamiya Merkava I, which I wouldn't bother with, now that Takom offers theirs. Takom also makes a 2B, which is not that much different from the Mark I Hybrid. I've built the Meng Merkava 3D Early, which is a great kit. And, as I've mentioned about the Hobbyboss Mark IV, I went with the Academy Mark IV LIC, which actually built up very nicely. And, like Eric, I'm working on the Meng Mark 4M with Trophy, which I'm very happy with thus far, about 25% done. This Merkava 4M is THE LATEST real-life tank, and the latest kit, so it's the latest of the latest! I don't think you can go wrong with Meng, honestly. I've used Friul metal tracks on all of the tanks I've built.

I think the above pretty much covers it. Feel free to ask any questions you may have. Hope this helped.
dwnrng44
Visit this Community
Michigan, United States
Joined: September 15, 2009
KitMaker: 23 posts
Armorama: 22 posts
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 - 08:32 AM UTC
My vote is for the Meng Mk IV w/Trophy. The fit and detail are excellent. Meng's casting of the ball and chain is beautiful and goes on easy, as in their MK III kit. Just be careful removing them from the sprue and cleaning up. The only letdown is the tracks. I replaced with MasterClub. Fruilmodels are nice too. Had so much fun, the Takom Merkava Mk 1 is next up.
M4A1Sherman
Visit this Community
New York, United States
Joined: May 02, 2013
KitMaker: 3,921 posts
Armorama: 3,876 posts
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 - 09:04 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Hi, People!

I'd like to build a 1/35 example of one of the very latest Merkavas- I'm lost at sea, here... Any advice besides "sort of" staying away from the HOBBY BOSS Merkava kits..?



Dennis,

Bob Woodman pretty much covered what I would say, but here are my own thoughts. I'm not sure what you meant by 'latest', whether you meant latest kits or latest real-life Merkava tanks. I'll assume you meant kits.

The early Merkavas, Mark I and Mark I Hybrid...Takom, absolutely! I've built the Mark I, and have the Hybrid, which I will build one day. The only other 1/35 scale I know of is the ancient Tamiya Merkava I, which I wouldn't bother with, now that Takom offers theirs. Takom also makes a 2B, which is not that much different from the Mark I Hybrid. I've built the Meng Merkava 3D Early, which is a great kit. And, as I've mentioned about the Hobbyboss Mark IV, I went with the Academy Mark IV LIC, which actually built up very nicely. And, like Eric, I'm working on the Meng Mark 4M with Trophy, which I'm very happy with thus far, about 25% done. This Merkava 4M is THE LATEST real-life tank, and the latest kit, so it's the latest of the latest! I don't think you can go wrong with Meng, honestly. I've used Friul metal tracks on all of the tanks I've built.

I think the above pretty much covers it. Feel free to ask any questions you may have. Hope this helped.



Hi, All, and Thank You Bob, Curt and Eric for your GREAT INFO!

As I know NADA, NADO, NICHEVO, NICHTS and NOTHING except for the blatantly obvious "general" information about Merkavas, being that they are Tanks in service with the Israeli Army, perhaps I should have myself clearer- What I meant was in fact, that I am interested in obtaining the latest and BEST 1/35 MODEL of the real-life Merkava 4M with "Trophy". From your info, I gather that the kit of the MENG-persuasion is the one to buy, so that's what Ol' Uncle Dennis is going to do... Thanks, Much!
system
Visit this Community
England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: November 24, 2008
KitMaker: 345 posts
Armorama: 344 posts
Posted: Friday, March 29, 2019 - 08:48 PM UTC
Hobby Boss has put up pictures of packaging and instructions - no sprue shots yet.

http://www.hobbyboss.com/index.php?g=home&m=product&a=show&id=1467&l=en

Looks like they might have fixed the staggered suspension issue, but otherwise I'm not getting a warm fuzzy feeling. It looks like it still has many of the same old issues - plus don't most 4M's have the loader's hatch, hull APU and non-wavy skirts?

I guess we'll have to wait until we see plastic.
ReluctantRenegade
Visit this Community
Wien, Austria
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 2,070 posts
Armorama: 2,026 posts
Posted: Friday, March 29, 2019 - 10:56 PM UTC

Quoted Text

don't most 4M's have the loader's hatch



The Merkava 4 was originally designed without loader's hatch because it compromised turret armor integrity. The first series of Mk.4s were built without them, however, based on operational experiences, they were reintroduced on later examples; early ones are being retrofitted with them. Nowadays all new Mk.4s rolling off the production line are of the 'M' variant (i.e. Trophy equipped) and have loader's hatch. I think all Trophy fitted Mk.4s are designated 'M', regardless whether they factory- or retrofitted.



Quoted Text

hull APU



Yes


Quoted Text

non-wavy skirts



I only saw those on early examples - probably the ones without loader's hatch too.

What makes HB's version interesting, they've picked an early variant without loader's hatch but retrofitted with Trophy. Probably not the most common setup, but knowing IDF equipment diversity, seems totally plausible.

system
Visit this Community
England - East Anglia, United Kingdom
Joined: November 24, 2008
KitMaker: 345 posts
Armorama: 344 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 30, 2019 - 03:26 AM UTC
That's useful info - thanks!

I'll still probably avoid this one, even if it's a valid configuration. No matter how many times I look at it, Hobby Boss' Merk just looks wrong in profile.






(and apologies to Carlos Blanco for using his model as an example...)