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Armor/AFV: IDF [Israeli Defense Forces]
Armor and AFVs of the IDF army from 1947-today.
Hosted by Darren Baker
M60 with ERA
Recon
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Wisconsin, United States
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 08:14 AM UTC
I have the dragon kit #3581. Which conflict is this tank appropriate for?
Thanks
Mike
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 09:53 AM UTC
I would say 1980's-90's time frame. Definitely not Six-Day-War or Yom Kippur War 1973. Probably used in Lebanon wars.
GTDeath13
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 06:13 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I have the dragon kit #3581. Which conflict is this tank appropriate for?
Thanks
Mike



Lebanon 1982. Operation Peace for Galilee.

But... if you plan to use the barrel with the thermal sleeve you need a different turret basket, larger than the original.
JSSVIII
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 06:23 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

I have the dragon kit #3581. Which conflict is this tank appropriate for?
Thanks
Mike



Lebanon 1982. Operation Peace for Galilee.

But... if you plan to use the barrel with the thermal sleeve you need a different turret basket, larger than the original.



Unless they fixed it, the barrel with the thermal sleeve in kit #3581 is totally wrong for ANY tank, the barrel runs through the center of the bore evacuator instead of being offset to the bottom like it should be. You should replace it if you want it to be correct, it's a real noticeable detail to get wrong on a tank, it's a shame really.
GTDeath13
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 06:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text



Unless they fixed it, the barrel with the thermal sleeve in kit #3581 is totally wrong for ANY tank, the barrel runs through the center of the bore evacuator instead of being offset to the bottom like it should be. You should replace it if you want it to be correct, it's a real noticeable detail to get wrong on a tank, it's a shame really.



I refrained from mentioning the inaccuracies of the kit... The barrel is just the tip of the iceberg...
JSSVIII
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 06:43 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text



Unless they fixed it, the barrel with the thermal sleeve in kit #3581 is totally wrong for ANY tank, the barrel runs through the center of the bore evacuator instead of being offset to the bottom like it should be. You should replace it if you want it to be correct, it's a real noticeable detail to get wrong on a tank, it's a shame really.



I refrained from mentioning the inaccuracies of the kit... The barrel is just the tip of the iceberg...



Sorry, I just couldn't help myself, for a manufacturer to make a mistake like that on the barrel of a tank kit, its like someone publishing a book with a typo on the COVER!
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Friday, August 25, 2017 - 10:14 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

I have the dragon kit #3581. Which conflict is this tank appropriate for?
Thanks
Mike



Lebanon 1982. Operation Peace for Galilee.

But... if you plan to use the barrel with the thermal sleeve you need a different turret basket, larger than the original.



Unless they fixed it, the barrel with the thermal sleeve in kit #3581 is totally wrong for ANY tank, the barrel runs through the center of the bore evacuator instead of being offset to the bottom like it should be. You should replace it if you want it to be correct, it's a real noticeable detail to get wrong on a tank, it's a shame really.




What are the odds that this barrel has been reused in Dragons new M48A5 kit? News item published today ...
/ Robin
JSSVIII
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 12:47 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

I have the dragon kit #3581. Which conflict is this tank appropriate for?
Thanks
Mike



Lebanon 1982. Operation Peace for Galilee.

But... if you plan to use the barrel with the thermal sleeve you need a different turret basket, larger than the original.





Unless they fixed it, the barrel with the thermal sleeve in kit #3581 is totally wrong for ANY tank, the barrel runs through the center of the bore evacuator instead of being offset to the bottom like it should be. You should replace it if you want it to be correct, it's a real noticeable detail to get wrong on a tank, it's a shame really.




What are the odds that this barrel has been reused in Dragons new M48A5 kit? News item published today ...
/ Robin



I don't think the M48A5 used the barrel with the thermal sleeve, which is the one that is wrong in the kit. The 105mm gun without the thermal sleeve seems to be correct in the Magach 3 kit though, so hopefully it will be in the A5 kit.

Dragon has made quite a few horrible errors in the past few years, even with people advising them with proper info. They don't seem to have resorted to actively adding mistakes to parts that were already correct...yet.
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 01:07 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

...


What are the odds that this barrel has been reused in Dragons new M48A5 kit? News item published today ...
/ Robin



I don't think the M48A5 used the barrel with the thermal sleeve, which is the one that is wrong in the kit. The 105mm gun without the thermal sleeve seems to be correct in the Magach 3 kit though, so hopefully it will be in the A5 kit.

Dragon has made quite a few horrible errors in the past few years, even with people advising them with proper info. They don't seem to have resorted to actively adding mistakes to parts that were already correct...yet.




If the M105 barrel in the Magach 3 kit is the one reused from
Dragon 3553 M60 then there is this review here on Armorama:
http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Reviews&file=index&req=showcontent&id=12592
saying this:
"3. The gun barrel is just a piece of junk... It is correct in length, but way too thin. Actually it looks like the part in front of the bore evacuator is more or less correct, but the evacuator itself and the barrel part between it and the mantlet are MUCH too thin. "

Oh well, I suppose aftermarket barrels are, or will be, available
/ Robin
JSSVIII
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 03:37 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

...


What are the odds that this barrel has been reused in Dragons new M48A5 kit? News item published today ...
/ Robin



I don't think the M48A5 used the barrel with the thermal sleeve, which is the one that is wrong in the kit. The 105mm gun without the thermal sleeve seems to be correct in the Magach 3 kit though, so hopefully it will be in the A5 kit.

Dragon has made quite a few horrible errors in the past few years, even with people advising them with proper info. They don't seem to have resorted to actively adding mistakes to parts that were already correct...yet.




If the M105 barrel in the Magach 3 kit is the one reused from
Dragon 3553 M60 then there is this review here on Armorama:
http://www.armorama.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Reviews&file=index&req=showcontent&id=12592
saying this:
"3. The gun barrel is just a piece of junk... It is correct in length, but way too thin. Actually it looks like the part in front of the bore evacuator is more or less correct, but the evacuator itself and the barrel part between it and the mantlet are MUCH too thin. "

Oh well, I suppose aftermarket barrels are, or will be, available
/ Robin



Thanks Robin, I stand corrected, but there is still hope that they will fix the barrel. Ok, probably not, but you're also right about aftermarket barrels.
Cheyenne56a
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Rhode Island, United States
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 05:59 AM UTC
The USMC had M60s w/ERA in ODS 1991
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 12:00 PM UTC
Aluminum/Aluminium barrels look better anyway
I usually consider the styrene barrels to be fixable but now I'll seriously consider a aftermarket barrel

/ Robin
glock17c
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Jerusalem, Israel
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 12:06 PM UTC
I think that we should thank Dragon for their new lines of IDF Magach and Halftracks.
But.. the poor research was leading to innacurate models.
I refer only to some photos in the net, so the Main gun, can be with the Thermal sleeve, only when there is a crosswind mast on the turret and the new FCS. This is in a matter of fact a Magach 6M where theone without the thermal sleeve and mast is the Magach 6R.
Yes, the gun barrels in all the Dragon Magach series, is horrible, as well as the dust covers, but this can be replaced with the after-market guns like the ones from DEF-Models.
Another problem is the boxed shape grenade launcher, that has 10 rounds in real, 14 in the Magach 3 ERA and 12 in the Magach 6. This is a serious mistake as it should be easy to notify. All of that leads to one conclusion, that the research by Dragon is poor.
Recon
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Posted: Saturday, August 26, 2017 - 06:21 PM UTC
Which DEF update set do i need to get to correct the kit?
Mike