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Armor/AFV: IDF [Israeli Defense Forces]
Armor and AFVs of the IDF army from 1947-today.
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More Academy Merkava IV Parts Questions
cabasner
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Nevada, United States
Joined: February 12, 2012
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Posted: Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 03:28 AM UTC
All,

A few more Merkava IV questions. Any help would be greatly appreciated!! :

Photo etch part PE12: This part is in the kit PE parts. I have not seen any photos of this part in any Merk IV photos, including the Desert Eagle book. What is this part, and should it be there?


Photo etch part 61: This part is from an Eduard PE set. Again, I've not been able to find any pictures of this part in any Merk IV photos. What is this, and does it belong there, and if it does, how should it be installed? There appears to be about half of the part can 'fold', but the Eduard instructions don't indicate and folding or other modification to the part before install. I'm at a loss!
Armorsmith
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Pennsylvania, United States
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Posted: Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 03:33 AM UTC
Recently finished this kit myself. As for the 1st part you show I have no idea what it is but leave it off till just prior to painting as I kept knocking it off. Are you using the kit PE ball and chain? If so I can give you a few tips if you want. Also curious to see if you have any luck with the PE screen around the sight/rangefinder(?) in front of the loaders hatch. Had no luck with mine and left it off.
cabasner
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Nevada, United States
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Posted: Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 08:59 AM UTC
@ dvsand,

Thanks so much for answering my two posts. I would be hugely grateful if you could look up the B30 parts for me. I'll leave the PE12 part off until the tank is ready for paint, as I can see that you are correct, that it would be a pain to not knock off. Regarding the 61 part, I actually did see it on ONE photo of the real tank, but the photo was far away from the turret top, and I could not see the details of the location. As of the moment, I do see that you have to bend the part 90 degrees, but it beats me as to the exact location on the turret top, because anywhere close to where the Eduard instructions tell you that it goes, it does not fit the curve of the turret top. If you can find out anything I'll be hugely grateful.

Regarding the ball and chain, I have 3 sets of Voyager ball and chain sets, and am thinking that I'd like to use those instead of the kit supplied PE chain and 1/2 plastic balls, but would love to hear of your experiences with those ball/chains, however you did it.

And, about the PE screen around the sight/rangefinder, I do have it in place, but I must tell you that it took me about 6 tries to get it right. I had it super glued the first time, and the angle was wrong, so I had to use superglue de-bonder, which wreaks havoc with plastic (it puts a white crazed finish in the plastic, and lucky that the base plastic part was not destroyed in using that debonding stuff). I realized, after looking at photos of the real tank, and after gluing the screen in place that first time, that the screen is supposed to be fully vertical on all sides of the base part (well at least for the ~270 degrees that the screen goes around). You can't just glue the bottom edge of PE part to the base equally from the bottom of the plastic base, or the PE screen will end up 'cocked' forward and sideways. I ended up doing this: I found a wooden dowel (in my Small Shop PE tool shaping kit) that was as close to the diameter of the plastic base as is in the shaping kit. I wrapped the PE screen around that dowel at one of the ends, and taped it tightly around the dowel. Then, I CAREFULLY inserted the plastic base inside the bottom edge of the screen, and tried as best as I could to align the screen such that it was going to be completely vertical around the entire perimeter when the plastic base was glued to the turret top. This took me about 30 minutes of sweating blood to get it aligned right, given the essentially micro adjustments I had to make. Only after getting it to sit right, did I take some superglue and drop small amounts on the bottom edge of the PE screen, such that it would glue the screen to the plastic. I left it to dry for over an hour, and propped the other end of the dowel so that the screen/base didn't rest against anything and move the screen while the glue dried. It turned out fine (though I haven't painted it yet), but it was truly a nightmare. if you have trouble understanding what I have described, I can try to simulate what I did in a series of pictures, which I can post for you, or describe on the phone if you'd like.
bison126
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Correze, France
Joined: June 10, 2004
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Posted: Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 02:50 PM UTC

Quoted Text

And, about the PE screen around the sight/rangefinder, I do have it in place, but I must tell you that it took me about 6 tries to get it right. I had it super glued the first time, and the angle was wrong, so I had to use superglue de-bonder, which wreaks havoc with plastic (it puts a white crazed finish in the plastic, and lucky that the base plastic part was not destroyed in using that debunking stuff). I realized, after looking at photos of the real tank, and after gluing the screen in place that first time, that the screen is supposed to be fully vertical on all sides of the base part (well at least for the ~270 degrees that the screen goes around). You can't just glue the bottom edge of PE part to the base equally from the bottom of the plastic base, or the PE screen will end up 'cocked' forward and sideways. I ended up doing this: I found a wooden dowel (in my Small Shop PE tool shaping kit) that was as close to the diameter of the plastic base as is in the shaping kit. I wrapped the PE screen around that dowel at one of the ends, and taped it tightly around the dowel. Then, I CAREFULLY inserted the plastic base inside the bottom edge of the screen, and tried as best as I could to align the screen such that it was going to be completely vertical around the entire perimeter when the plastic base was glued to the turret top. This took me about 30 minutes of sweating blood to get it aligned right, given the essentially micro adjustments I had to make. Only after getting it to sit right, did I take some superglue and drop small amounts on the bottom edge of the PE screen, such that it would glue the screen to the plastic. I left it to dry for over an hour, and propped the other end of the dowel so that the screen/base didn't rest against anything and move the screen while the glue dried. It turned out fine (though I haven't painted it yet), but it was truly a nightmare. if you have trouble understanding what I have described, I can try to simulate what I did in a series of pictures, which I can post for you, or describe on the phone if you'd like.



Which PE part did you use, the kit one or the Eduard one? The first is wrong as I could observe from ref pictures when I built mine.

Concerning PE12, my guess is this is a support for a laptop/tablet or a map. But I did not see any on my ref books like you.

Olivier
Armorsmith
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Pennsylvania, United States
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Posted: Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 05:30 PM UTC
The problem with the kit supplied ball and chain is that there will be a visible seam around the diameter of the ball as the 2 halves of the plastic ball must be glued to a small disc on the PE chain. The real issue for me was how the completed ball and chain sections attached to the turret. For the life of me I could not get them to attach and look right so I ended up running a thin plastic strip around the bottom of the turret sides to get a better surface. These are something else you might want to leave off until the end as they are very easy to bend and knock out of alignment. Good luck with the ball and chain which ever route you go.

Thanks for the info about the screen. Mine is done and I'm not gong to try to remove the sight and fight with the screen. I can live with it the way it is.
cabasner
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Nevada, United States
Joined: February 12, 2012
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 07:06 AM UTC
Thanks for the info on the ball and chains, dvsand. The Hair of Shulamit, I think, is the origin of what those are called in Hebrew, though I'm sure I spelled it wrong.

Olivier, the shape of PE part PE12 makes sense as a computer or map holder, and I'm not sure if I will put it on my tank.

It turns out that I actually used the kit PE part for the rangefinder screen. Terrible, out of focus pictures with my iPhone below, but you'll get the idea. I haven't put anything together yet, except for the base and the screen. Lots more to do, with the 'short' additional piece of screen, the rangefinder itself, the rangefinder top and the 'support arms', then the screen part top section, plus the solid PE part that is supposed to be the rangefinder cover, none of which are in these pictures. Though out of focus, you might be able to see that the screen is actually oriented such that the screen is 90 degrees to the horizontal, around all sides of the screen (may not be that easy to discern in these photos, though).



ReluctantRenegade
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Wien, Austria
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 12:31 PM UTC

Quoted Text

The Hair of Shulamit, I think, is the origin of what those are called in Hebrew



That is the correct translation of "Sea'rot Shulamit". Nice to see you back in business, Curt.

avenue
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Philippines
Joined: May 25, 2013
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 01:03 PM UTC
how come all latter merkava model plastice kit do not include trophy ADS?
ReluctantRenegade
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Wien, Austria
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 01:14 PM UTC

Quoted Text

how come all latter merkava model plastice kit do not include trophy ADS?



Well, many of them are still not equipped with it anyway... The Mk.IV became operational in 2004, the "Trophy" APS in 2009. The first tank battalion received it in 2010.
cabasner
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Nevada, United States
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 06:54 PM UTC
[quote]
Quoted Text

. .... Nice to see you back in business, Curt.




Nice of you to say, Israel. Thank you 😊
Armorsmith
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Pennsylvania, United States
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 08:37 PM UTC
OK so I get up this morning and check this thread and find a picture of how Curt did the screen around the sight/rangefinder. I'm impressed but as noted earlier my kit is finished-painted weathered etc., on the shelf. Doing my morning chores, haircut, clean the pool, etc. I am bummed that I didn't manage to get it on and shamed at how well Curt did his. Sooooo, after ruminating on it for the better part of the morning I broke down and gave it a go. I was able to get the sight/rangefinder assembly removed, but the base was too firmly attached. I could probably have gotten it off but at the risk of damaging the surrounding area and was also worried about the ball and chain getting mangled. After about an hour I finally got it attached, though not as neat and clean as Curt. Letting the CA dry for now then onto the painting of the interior surfaces and fitting the top screen. It won't be a perfect fit but close enough and whose to say that it didn't get banged up a little in service. Damn you Curt!
Removed by original poster on 08/08/17 - 18:44:02 (GMT).
cabasner
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Nevada, United States
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 11:43 PM UTC
@ dvsand

Hey, my friend, I am thrilled that I was, in some small way, an inspiration for you to install the screen. You had to have really wanted to do it before we started trading posts, though LOL. I'm glad you ended up doing the screen, would love to see how it looks.
I'm sure it's fantastic!!
Your friendly neighborhood pain in the posterior 😊😊
Armorsmith
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Posted: Monday, August 07, 2017 - 11:44 PM UTC

Quoted Text

@ dvsand

Hey, my friend, I am thrilled that I was, in some small way, an inspiration for you to install the screen. You had to have really wanted to do it before we started trading posts LOL. I'm glad you ended up doing the screen, would love to see how it looks.

Your friendly neighborhood pain in the posterior 😊😊



Yeah, I guess you pushed me over the edge. As for photos I might eventually one day get around to learning how. I am somewhat technologically challenged. I still use an old flip phone.