Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 23, 2017 - 01:57 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Thanks for the info on the fenders Randall, and thanks for the comparison with the Meng kit also. I really wish someone would also hurry up and do a T-72AV already, there are so many excellent photos of that variant in Syria, and Ukraine.
I agree on the earlier T-72's. I found a YouTube video that was put up in January showing an older T-72 in combat in Palmyra. As a guess it is a T-72A, and looks new. In the same video is a T-62M.
The Trumpeter kit also has, for me, better fender boxes and fuel tanks, with PE for the straps. These parts are well molded on the Meng model, but are simplistic, and an opening for AM parts and PE.
I've always thought an enterprising company could make plastic detail sets. Well done replacement parts for the fender boxes on the T-72's would be nice.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
Armorama: 1,067 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 23, 2017 - 02:13 AM UTC
While they are not plastic, Miniarm makes a set of separate fuel tanks, and fender boxes that includes PE. I don't have a set yet, but the photos look nice.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 23, 2017 - 02:47 AM UTC
Quoted Text
While they are not plastic, Miniarm makes a set of separate fuel tanks, and fender boxes that includes PE. I don't have a set yet, but the photos look nice.
I didn't see that set, I'll get one and find out how they are. I got a Miniarm set for the T-55M that looks nice, but I haven't used it yet.
With filler on the Meng build curing I'm going to put the hull together on the Trumpeter kit and see how it builds. I'm willing to bet a nickel that Trumpeter comes out with the T-72B 1998 version right after I get all the parts sorted out.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 23, 2017 - 05:09 AM UTC
Well, after getting the hull top and front glued on I found the first problem with the Trumpeter model. Across the bottom is a real T-72, on the top left Meng, and to the top right Trumpeter. Meng is spot on, but the Trumpeter? A little too low perhaps, or Trumpeter got the angle wrong.
I'll have to replace the lugs strips, fill in the gap in the nose and reshape the edge. I think the upper plate edge is 90 degrees from the plate, which gives the nose that step look. Meng has it, and once the welds are redone will be accurate.
Maybe once I get my mind in focus I'll look into a 3D set to replace the Trumpeter goof (or goofs?).
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Monday, July 24, 2017 - 06:59 AM UTC
Moving along slowly. I picked up a Trumpeter T-90 cast turret kit today at the local shop to get the K5 blocks. I think the correct "B" add on plate is in the T-72B/B1 model. The Syrian T-72B Kontact 5 tanks seem to be odd balls.
I glued up the road wheels, then realized I forgot to nick up the rubber, so used the wheels from the T-90. Now I have a set of wheels saved up. All the wheels have an annoying shrink line on them. I chose to use all later wheels. My reference tank has late wheels.
Once on its wheels I found the Trumpeter model sits a little higher than the Meng model. I'm not sure who's right, or if it was my assembly. The difference is about .75mm. The Meng profile feels right to me, but that could be due to the color.
The Trumpeter turret seems a little taller as well. Both look good, and I think the profiles match different tanks.
When I assembled the Trumpeter turret I found there was a .25mm gap in the cheeks. If I bent the cheeks together the turret bottom bent up. Rather than risk a wobbly turret I used scrap plastic to fill the gaps.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 - 07:33 AM UTC
I started adding welds and the front hull fittings. The drivers hatch and fender are still loose. I have the Miniarm fender boxes and fuel tanks on order so am waiting on the set before doing any more work on the fenders. I had been wondering why the fenders showed so little damage on some tanks, even after an rpg hit, while the boxes were destroyed. After researching the T-72 I found the fenders were made with heavier plates than I expected, and are welded on.
Some of the video from the Palmyra fighting shows T-62s. One was a newer arrival, improved version, while another was an older model. I could not determine the version the older tank was, and doing a screen capture on YouTube eludes me! There were some very old tanks in some of the latest videos.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
United States
Joined: December 15, 2016
KitMaker: 50 posts
Armorama: 50 posts
Posted: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 - 06:50 PM UTC
I think you are describing the early T-62M without the machine gun mount (Trumpeter makes this kit). Trumpeter also makes what I call a T-62M middle and middle late kit. All three are used by the Syrian Army. If you want the final version from what I can tell you would have to change out the barrel and tracks. Hopes this helps:
[url=https://spioenkop.blogspot.com/2017/02/replenishing-stocks-russian-deliveries.html
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 - 11:11 PM UTC
Jonathan,
I hadn't noticed the T-62 with no mg. There are two in the one video, both in original configuration.
I did not see any up armored T-62 with the early turret. Most pics of the later T-62's look a lot like the Trumpeter T-62 1984 kit. That kit has the T-72 track.
I did find a lot of pictures of T-62's with the T-72 tracks, but no added armor or obvious upgrades. I guess those are the M's? I am still new to post WWII Soviet armor.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
United States
Joined: December 15, 2016
KitMaker: 50 posts
Armorama: 50 posts
Posted: Wednesday, July 26, 2017 - 09:58 PM UTC
Sorry I think my response was confusing. I am no expert either but I love researching Russian/Syrian armor. Most of the pictures of these Syrian tanks are no longer on the net but I saved quite a few if you need them. Here is a SAA T-62M kit list I came up with:
Trumpeter 1/35 T-62 kit # 01551
Trumpeter 1/35 T-62 1984 BDD kit # 01553 (early version)
Trumpeter 1/35 T-62 1985 BDD kit # 01554 (late version)
Last version of SAA T-62M in which pictures are hard to find: (use kit #01554, T-72 tracks, T-72 barrel with wrap, add anti-radiation cladding around turret). If you can find the old Mig conversion Taliban T-62M it would work with the thermal wrap barrel.
All the pictures show them new in dark green with Russian shipping labels still on. Most with minor damage to fenders but all have fuel tanks removed. Most have engine deck or radiator fan cover raised due to overheating (?). Most are in desert operations but I have one picture of the early version in urban combat.
Thanks for continuing your build!
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Thursday, July 27, 2017 - 01:15 AM UTC
I'm always getting confused with Russian/Soviet armor. I went looking for T-62's and was surprised how many Trumpeter had released.
I have two of the early versions, 1972 and 1976 I think. I am found kit 1553 at a very good price and managed to find kit 1554 at a decent price. T-62's are not as pricy as the T-72's.
Forum posts I found indicate the 1960 tanks were not used by Syria, but the 1967 and later versions were.
The YouTube video I was talking about shows a T-62 with no mg mounted, and has that big round loaders hatch. In the same shot is a later T-62 with the mg mount and smaller hatch. Both are in very good condition. I did not look for the fuel boxes, but I'll look again after work.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
New York, United States
Joined: September 23, 2006
KitMaker: 389 posts
Armorama: 358 posts
Posted: Thursday, July 27, 2017 - 02:22 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Last version of SAA T-62M in which pictures are hard to find: (use kit #01554, T-72 tracks, T-72 barrel with wrap, add anti-radiation cladding around turret). If you can find the old Mig conversion Taliban T-62M it would work with the thermal wrap barrel.
Pretty sure that the new T-62Ms supplied to the Syrians are still equipped with the 115mm gun.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Thursday, July 27, 2017 - 05:54 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I'm always getting confused with Russian/Soviet armor. I went looking for T-62's and was surprised how many Trumpeter had released.
I have two of the early versions, 1972 and 1976 I think. I am found kit 1553 at a very good price and managed to find kit 1554 at a decent price. T-62's are not as pricy as the T-72's.
Forum posts I found indicate the 1960 tanks were not used by Syria, but the 1967 and later versions were.
The YouTube video I was talking about shows a T-62 with no mg mounted, and has that big round loaders hatch. In the same shot is a later T-62 with the mg mount and smaller hatch. Both are in very good condition. I did not look for the fuel boxes, but I'll look again after work.
I got some of the dates wrong on the T-62's. That's what I get for posting at work. I have the 1972 and 1975 versions and both come with the T-72 tracks. I think the 1975 version is the model in one of the series of videos. There is at least one T-90 in the video.
Jonathan, if you have pictures of the Syrian T-62's I am very interested. The web is pretty bare at the moment.
Back at the T-72B3, I got in some Miniarm sets. I'll post some pics and thoughts on those when I get back to the model. Family issues at the moment are taking up my time.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
United States
Joined: December 15, 2016
KitMaker: 50 posts
Armorama: 50 posts
Posted: Friday, July 28, 2017 - 07:58 PM UTC
Now you have the modern armor bug. I swore I would never build modern armor now I am stuck on it! The more you get into modern armor the harder the reference is. You can always use the parts for the other T-62 kits believe me. Back on the T-62m late (last version) barrel it just has a new thermal wrap. I do not believe there is an AM replacement. It "looks" closest to me like a T-72 barrel with the thermal wrap and I think parts of this can be used. On the fuel tanks being removed I meant fuel barrels.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Friday, July 28, 2017 - 10:12 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Now you have the modern armor bug. I swore I would never build modern armor now I am stuck on it! The more you get into modern armor the harder the reference is. You can always use the parts for the other T-62 kits believe me. Back on the T-62m late (last version) barrel it just has a new thermal wrap. I do not believe there is an AM replacement. It "looks" closest to me like a T-72 barrel with the thermal wrap and I think parts of this can be used. On the fuel tanks being removed I meant fuel barrels.
I did not find any metal barrels for the T-62, then discovered Trumpeter kits come with a metal barrel. I am not planning on a late T-62M at the moment. If that changes I'll compare T-72 barrels.
I did see one example of a Syrian tank with the fuel drums on the back, but it got lost in the cloud. Now I can't find the picture. There are T-55's and T-62's with fender fuel tanks missing. Usually one or two.
One feature I really like on the Trumpeter T-62's, T-72's and T-90's are the separate fenders, and the hull sides being one piece. No aggravating seams on the hull sides to deal with. The seams on the Meng kits are hidden by the fenders and rear hull fittings, but if you remove the fenders there is a seam to deal with.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
#161
New York, United States
Joined: May 03, 2010
KitMaker: 392 posts
Armorama: 373 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 29, 2017 - 02:35 AM UTC
I've got one of these on my wishlist, I'll be following this closely.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 06:25 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I've got one of these on my wishlist, I'll be following this closely.
I tend to build slowly so bear with me. I can also get side tracked!
Researching the T-72B3 and T-90's I noticed some had the 4 fittings on the rear hull left off or lost, with just the spare tracks mounted. I'm not sure what those are, and the details were poor so I drilled holes for rod that will be the mounting rods. Later I will cut them all down to size and add cross bars and bolts.
On the turret Meng just ignores holes that are not used so after careful study of what goes on I filled what I didn't need. My method is to drill to a standard plastic rod size and glue in a bit of rod. Later I will smooth the ends and add a little filler as a casting effect. The hole for the no longer used light on the right front has been treated, the holes on the rear are in process.
Comparing the Meng B3 to the Trumpeter B turret so far. At least the Meng doesn't need the hundred or so tiny round things that secure the matting on!
I am using a Miniarm exhaust set. The Meng outlet is very shallow. I think I messed it up a little, but it should be fine with everything on.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
Armorama: 1,067 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 03:06 PM UTC
Randall, so the Miniarm exhaust is worth the money then? Other than the outlet depth, is the detail that much better? I was thinking of getting one, but I wasn't sure it would be worth it.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 08:05 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Randall, so the Miniarm exhaust is worth the money then? Other than the outlet depth, is the detail that much better? I was thinking of getting one, but I wasn't sure it would be worth it.
I got the exhaust set just to see what it looks like.
The detail is slightly better than the Meng kit parts. How much of that will be better after painting I can't tell. To me the better depth to the outlet is obvious so I used it, and will more than likely get another set for my planned T-90. Once I compare it to the Trumpeter exhaust I'll have a better opinion over-all. I'm going to do some work on the Trumpeter kit this week.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
St. Petersburg, Russia
Joined: September 05, 2015
KitMaker: 136 posts
Armorama: 133 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 08:43 PM UTC
Why did you use so much putty on the glacis plate? Are there large gaps? I got Meng BMPT which basically has the same hull and it all fitted OK.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 11:44 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Why did you use so much putty on the glacis plate? Are there large gaps? I got Meng BMPT which basically has the same hull and it all fitted OK.
I do not have the BMPT kit so I can't compare the glacis plates. On the B3 kit the upper hull part fits on the lower hull then the glacis insert is added. This creates 2 gaps at the nose on each side of what should be the true one piece glacis plate surface. On the upper sides there is a gap that I filled in, but could be where a weld should go.
The fenders and the rods on the nose cover most of those seams, but I filled it all as much as I could. A small part is not covered and can be seen. Some of the filler is added welds and covering over cuts from removing the electrical lines.
I got a little too much filler on the nose area.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 30, 2017 - 11:50 PM UTC
The Meng and the Miniarm exhaust. The pale tan resin does not photograph very well. The advantage of the Miniarm outlet can be seen. I left the defect on, it adds character.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
St. Petersburg, Russia
Joined: September 05, 2015
KitMaker: 136 posts
Armorama: 133 posts
Posted: Monday, July 31, 2017 - 01:07 AM UTC
Oh yeah the Miniarm thing looks great. I have several of their wheels kits, and they all are super. Especially the ones for SS-23 are a monster. I'll get this exhaust for my future T-72, too.
Massachusetts, United States
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
Armorama: 1,067 posts
Posted: Monday, July 31, 2017 - 03:04 AM UTC
Yes, the exhaust looks very nice! Are those the Miniarm fuel tanks and zip boxes I see peeking out from the top of some of those pictures also?
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Monday, July 31, 2017 - 05:26 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Yes, the exhaust looks very nice! Are those the Miniarm fuel tanks and zip boxes I see peeking out from the top of some of those pictures also?
Yes. Those are nice parts, but until I sort out the fender supports I'm not working on them. I just got in a PE set that I need to look at for the fender supports. I might do a 3D print set if the PE is too thin.
I've been a little lazy today. Too much time looking at stuff to buy, and not working on the models. Not to mention the YouTube T-72 videos!
Seriously, the Russians sent T-90's, T-72B3's and no helmets!
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
Arizona, United States
Joined: January 18, 2006
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,808 posts
Posted: Monday, July 31, 2017 - 05:30 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Oh yeah the Miniarm thing looks great. I have several of their wheels kits, and they all are super. Especially the ones for SS-23 are a monster. I'll get this exhaust for my future T-72, too.
Miniart makes some nice sets. By the time they get over here the cost is a little high, but I found a good price on the exhaust.
I found a nifty feature on the forums called HIDE USER.
I was going to try it on myself and go stealth, but it only works on other users.
