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TANK MODEL HELP
micromos
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Alabama, United States
Joined: March 12, 2017
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Posted: Saturday, March 11, 2017 - 11:23 PM UTC
Hi, We are new at building kits and need some expert help. We have a Dragon tiger 1 late production w/Zimmerit tank and can't figure out how the wheel axles attach to the inside of the tank box. Question A: In the instructions step 2 shows the axles attaches to a part labels H3. They are marked in blue. We are wondering if the H3 part is just a single circular piece or is it a double circular shaped piece. Question B: The end of the axle that attaches to the H3 part seems to be flat on one side and fits into H3. Is that correct? Question C: Once assembled are the wheel and track supposed to rotate/move or just be fixed for display. Sorry about the long request. Any help or advise you can give us will be greatly appreciated. THX Donn & Jeff
Vicious
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Queensland, Australia
Joined: September 04, 2015
KitMaker: 1,425 posts
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Posted: Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 03:56 AM UTC
Dragon track are not workable they dont move,i never did that kit but unfortunately Dragon instructions are famous for their difficulty of understanding and serial errors, do one or two dry fitting tests before glue the pieces, maybe write the kit serial number so 'to know wath precise model you talkabout because Dragon has produced Billions and billions of different kits of Tiger1 ..... there are fewer stars in the Milky Way that Tiger made by Dragon...
RobinNilsson
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 05:39 AM UTC
A. Part H1 is the swing arm (visible on the outside, this is where the weheel will attach later) combined with a torsion bar. Part H3 is almost circular, it has a flat edge which will face the bottom of the hull, a back side which will face the side of the hull and a front side with a rectangular slot for the rectangular end of part H1.
On the instruction sheet there is a top view showing the torsion bars crossing the bottom of the hull.
A torsion bar suspension consists of a fixed point (H3 in the instructions), the torsion bar (the long stick on part H1) and some kind of arm on the other end of the torsion bar to cause a twisting motion.
H1 from the left side of the hull goes through a hole in the left side of the hull, across the bottom and into the slot in part H3. H3 is glued to the right inside of the hull. H1 is glued into H3 but NOT into the hole in the left hull side.
This is supposed to give the model a working suspension, pushing a wheel upwards will twist the torsion bar slightly and it will act as a spring.
If you look at the inside of the right hull side the H3 parts for the left hand side torsion bars will be between the "tubes" where the right hand side torsion bars enter the hull.

B. The flatness of the axle (torsion bar) enters into a similar hole in H3 to get a fixed position so that this end can not rotate (if it could rotate the torsion bar idea would not work, one end of the spring would be lose)

C. I don't think that the wheels are supposed to rotate (not sure about exact which kit number you have). I found instructions for nr 6383 and the wheels in that kit doesn't look as if they can rotate after assembly. The suspension should be possible to make workable (see above) but the tracks (one long piece of some rubbery material) will probably interfere.
Maybe this feature is useful for those who want to position their tank on an uneven surface in a diorama.
I would go with "fixed for display", moving parts have a tendency of breaking ...

/ Robin
micromos
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Alabama, United States
Joined: March 12, 2017
KitMaker: 4 posts
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Posted: Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 10:10 PM UTC
Sorry, I thought I had put in the kit #6383 when I posted. Thanks for your input. It will be a slow go for building the kit but I will keep you advised on our progress if you are interested. Donn
micromos
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Alabama, United States
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Posted: Sunday, March 12, 2017 - 10:17 PM UTC
Robin, Sorry, I thought I had put in the kit #6383 when I posted. Thanks for your extensive reply. It is very descriptive and explains a lot to us. We don't have a lot of time to spend on building the kit so it will be a slow go but I will keep you advised on our progress if you are interested. Donn
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 12:19 AM UTC
Hi Donn,
Please keep us posted :-)
There will probably be further snags and questions further into the build.
One of the things that make-or-break the looks of a tank kit is the proper alignment of the road wheels. In my opinion there is almost nothing that ruins the appearance as much as misaligned road wheels. The interleaved road wheels on the Tiger is a little more forgiving in this respect but all the time and care invested in getting the wheels lined up properly is worth every second.
Rotating wheels and movable suspension usually causes extra work and trouble since plastic is a lot more wobbly than steel axles and roller bearings.

For a tank without "working" suspension, these kits usually have a very small "play" in how much the swing arms can swing/rotate:
I would suggest that all the swing arms (the outside parts of H1) are glued in place. One way to do this is to set the tank on "cinder blocks"

by setting it on two rods (even thickness) and then glue in the swing arms so that the lower ends touches the work table.
Another way, if it is difficult to find suitable spacers, is to glue one of the corner swing arms first. When this has dried solid the swing arm on the opposite side is glued in.
Example: start with right rear, then left rear.
Now you have one end of the tank at the correct height and level (left-right). Now it is time to glue in one swing arm at a corner in the other end (for instance left front) and keep the tank leveled left-right and front-rear. Then comes the final corner. Now the tank should be level with all four swing arms resting on a flat surface. Glue in the other swing arms in alignment with the front and rears.

This kit can be done slightly differently.
Assemble all the swing arms as per the instructions making sure that they are inserted to the same "depth" into the hull sides. Dry fit to be certain of this.
Use side views to determine the "ride height" of the tank, you will need to dry fit the corner road wheels for this.
When the tank is level at the wanted ride height then add glue to the swing arms carrying the four road wheels.
Let dry.
Remove the road wheels and align the rest of the swing arms.

/ Robin
micromos
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Alabama, United States
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 02:25 AM UTC
Wow, with your help I'll be a model builder in no time. I tried to submit a picture but the system won't let me?
RobinNilsson
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Stockholm, Sweden
Joined: November 29, 2006
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Posted: Monday, March 13, 2017 - 02:44 AM UTC
The picture has to be available "on the net" somewhere.
I think the membership here on this site includes a, limited, storage area for images. Otherwise you could use photobucket or any of the other "free" photo sharing sites (you sell your soul to us and we give you some storage space in exchange, sort of .., they can sell your images if someone wants to buy copies ....)
Anyway, once you have the pictures somewhere you push the [img] button in the dark bar just below the editing field when you post something and then paste the web-link to the image inside the brackets, it says:
"http://put.url.here/image.file"
between two boxy start and stop brackets.
Modeling isn't difficult at all really, once you know how to do it
One of the really tricky bits is to be patient and careful. Another "skill" is to be able to see the potential in everyday items: "What could this piece of copper wire be used for? Grab irons, ladder rungs, flatten it and use it to replicate leather straps? "
Not being afraid to ask for tips and help is another "skill"
/ Robin


I'm sort of doing "modelling by proxy" at the moment. Don't have the time and space to do it myself right now so I assist others instead