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For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
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My Takom T30
Tedwards252
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South Carolina, United States
Joined: July 12, 2012
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Posted: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 - 08:09 PM UTC

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Any chance you measured the space between the road wheels?


Yes. Each spacing was different. None were the same.


I'm sure there were slight differences (obviously there was the larger gap between the first and second road wheels), but do you have an approximate average size? 1" - 2" - 3", there has been considerable discussion about how close together the road wheels look on the kit, compared to the real thing, but nobody had a measurement on the actual tank.


I don't remember how the head of the restoration shop there phrased it, but the roadwheel spacing is irrelevant. What is important is the distance between torsion-bar arms. The wheel spacing had an average of about 3.75 inches with the standard deviation of about 0.5 inches. Min was around an inch, and the max was about 5. It was very tight in some cases and very distant in others. (Sorry for the statistician in me coming out.) The factors contributing to this where the different vehicle weights, tire wear, and years of sitting idle. I'll do what I can to find out more, but no promises on info anytime soon. Classes resume in a few days... So goodbye freetime until May.
tankmodeler
#417
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Ontario, Canada
Joined: March 01, 2004
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Posted: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 - 10:41 PM UTC

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Also, the weld connecting the upper and lower turret halves was extremely gnarly.

Tedwards,

Just one point of correction. The turret is not welded together, it is sand cast in one piece. What you are thinking is a weld is actually the casting seam between the upper and lower parts of the turret mould. It looks gnarly because the seam has been torch cut/ground away to leave that beveled undersurface at the base of the turret.

Great photos, BTW. I'd be happy to see any more you post as these babies are on my list to do as well.

Paul
Blaubar
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Rheinland-Pfalz, Germany
Joined: December 15, 2016
KitMaker: 261 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 - 10:52 PM UTC
This will be a great blog here. Looking forward to more contribution from the guys on here. Such a beast this T30!
/Stefan
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 19, 2017 - 04:51 AM UTC
Made a little progress over the weekend. Finally was able to setup the paints over the weekend. Got the wheels and tyres painted.





They still need weathering and touching up. I have them with the million wheels from the T95!! That took some doing, so... many... wheels...

I got part of the camo done. I think I am going to go with the camo from the box but lighten it up a little, make it a little more alpine. Something different from the rest of the models on the bench.

Also tempted to go a little more 'what if' than just the camo and give it some battle damage. See how the cam comes out first.
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - 04:14 AM UTC
Made a start on the first layer of camo. I usually tone the shadows as a base coat and then start layering but (stupidly) drew my camo plan on first. As I started layering I was going over the pattern plan so just had to back off a little.





Looks kinda ordinary at the moment but fingers crossed, when I get the next 2 colours down, it will start to come to life.
ScottLind
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Alabama, United States
Joined: March 12, 2013
KitMaker: 36 posts
Armorama: 33 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 28, 2017 - 03:08 AM UTC
I really liked the ease of assembly on the jigs.... BUT.... It's probably my fault for incorrectly spacing the indy links but when I went to mount the tracks I ended up a link short. If I do another kit like this I will go back to building the tracks on the the model with the road wheels in place. Don't get me wrong I love the process but most likely do to my own error it caused some grief.
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 28, 2017 - 02:09 PM UTC
Funny you mention that Scott. The tracks went together easier than I thought on the jig but once I got the paint done and tried a dry fit of wheels and (assembled) track, it was too tight to fit the front road wheel. I had to pull it apart and add an extra link on both sides. One extra link made it a perfect fit.

I finished the camo pattern which came out ok but not great. I think it misses the pre-shading or I am just used to it being there.



The picture shows the dark shade as gloss but it is nothing like that to the eye. All dull matt.

The wheels needed a little more work. I added a wash to add some depth and a little oil grime to the deepest parts to make the bolts stand out a little. Added a touch or 2 of rust streaks on the hull, some dark green grime wash around the engine plates and a little streaking.



The streaking disappeared into the camo Haven't decided if I will retry lighter or not.

Done the same with the turret. Since it is so big I added a few more rust streaks on top to break it up.

Bravo1102
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: December 08, 2003
KitMaker: 2,864 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, March 28, 2017 - 06:45 PM UTC
Looks great. Like that summer verdant camouflage. Needs some huge honking black stars on the turret side like one of those 1970s USAEUR tanks.
JSSVIII
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, March 29, 2017 - 04:07 AM UTC
Nice job, can't wait to see it with the tracks on!
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 02, 2017 - 07:17 AM UTC
Time for a big update!

Been a while and got some time over the weekend. Had some issues with the tracks fitting with the missing wheel from the jig. Added one link in each side and tested fitted them.



Gave the tracks a couple of coats in different track colours (looks much better when dried)



Put the tracks on and gave the weak areas a touch up.



Got the side skirts and storage attached. Several places needed (and still need) touching up.



DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 02, 2017 - 07:25 AM UTC
I started playing with weathering the mufflers. In the pictures it doesn't look too bad but to the eye it looked terrible.



I decided I would go a different path and dry weather them with pigments. The down side is, this makes them look 100 years old, not just 5 years in the field worn. Making it worse my camera loves picking up reds in rust!

All the pigment not on the exhaust is barely visible to the eye but the camera has intensified the colour. I will have to tone it down and maybe add some green back over the top when I get a chance.



The build so far:


Next will be adding the details, tools, touch up, lights etc.
Kelley
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Georgia, United States
Joined: November 21, 2002
KitMaker: 1,966 posts
Armorama: 1,635 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - 06:37 AM UTC
Looking good Dazza. When/if you get a chance, could you post some pics from "eye level?" (how it would look if standing next to one and taking the shots)

Cheers,
Mike
Blaubar
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Rheinland-Pfalz, Germany
Joined: December 15, 2016
KitMaker: 261 posts
Armorama: 246 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - 12:15 PM UTC
Agree with what has been asked. A shot taken from a spectator's perspective would be quite nice!
À lovely build so far!
/Stefan
JSSVIII
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Massachusetts, United States
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
Armorama: 1,067 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - 02:57 PM UTC
"Been a while and got some time over the weekend. Had some issues with the tracks fitting with the missing wheel from the jig. Added one link in each side and tested fitted them."

...so there was a problem with the track jig then?
laikneth
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Singapore / 新加坡
Joined: September 24, 2013
KitMaker: 75 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 05, 2017 - 04:30 PM UTC
i built the t30 and t29e3 using the jig. no fit problems and i followed instructions to a T.

do note that on one side of the jig there are small protrusions. these are guide for placing the tracks so that there won't be any alignment or spacing issues.

Ken
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 02:04 PM UTC
Wow, been a long break on this one. Was expectantly sent overseas for work so everything got put on hiatus. Sometimes these things happen when we least expect (and want ) them to.

So the track jig was good but the reason it went pear shaped for me was the extra tension (?) wheel just under the rear wheel. I must've glued it too low so it needed one extra track piece to make up for the extra distance the track needed. My bad! but it all turned out just fine.

So where I left off was about here...

Exhaust was WAY too rusty, needed a little battle damage on the mantlet, too much rust on the spare tracks and probably another 100 things I have forgotten about!

Plus my camera making it look like either the tank is 200 years old with rust reflection (flash on) or has no detail at all (flash off)!

When I finally got a few minutes to myself, I toned down the rust on the exhaust and spare tracks. Added some battle damage to the mantlet.



I added a few of the tools and finer detail parts. A few of them MIA. Never sit a model unfinished for a month in a house of kids!


This is the tank flash on/flash off. I will need to sort out something much better for pictures. To the eye it is somewhere in the middle. Has the detail but very little of the rust.

When I next get a chance to work on it, I will be (hopefully) finding the missing parts, working out markings, cleaning up some paint work, finding a better place to take pictures!!
TankSGT
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: July 25, 2006
KitMaker: 1,139 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 07:09 PM UTC
I know its to late to change but your tracks are on backwards. Google pictures of the T30. The cleat goes narrow end down.

Tom
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 05:19 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I know its to late to change but your tracks are on backwards. Google pictures of the T30. The cleat goes narrow end down.

Tom


AAHHHHH CRAP!!! How the hell did I get that wrong!!

Hmmm, this one might sit on the back burner shelf for a while. I think from memory, I used extra glue in the sprocket to hold the tracks on. So close to finished and yet so far!
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 07, 2017 - 03:28 PM UTC
Well, even with the disappointment about the tracks, I need to get this one done. Too many unfinished kits, taking up too much room. I decided to get this one finished off.

Added the last few bits, tow cables, hooks, holders, etc. I made and painted the head lights but don't like the way they look on the tank so they can go into storage.


Added the decals


Which were way too bright so had to tone and weather them down


And have added it to the line up of dust collectors
SEDimmick
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New Jersey, United States
Joined: March 15, 2002
KitMaker: 1,745 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 08, 2017 - 12:27 AM UTC
Tracks get put on backwards all the time...your trying to man-handle something that weighs well over 500lbs for a section of 8 tracks. I did this once or twice on a M88 and it wasn't fun at all in the motorpool. I can imagine how much a pain it would be in the field or under combat conditions.
DazzaD
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South Australia, Australia
Joined: June 17, 2007
KitMaker: 235 posts
Armorama: 232 posts
Posted: Friday, June 09, 2017 - 06:15 AM UTC
You win! Rather have it wrong on this than the real thing. No back breaking work in 1/35 scale.
KurtLaughlin
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Pennsylvania, United States
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
Armorama: 2,377 posts
Posted: Sunday, May 19, 2019 - 12:30 PM UTC

Quoted Text


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Any chance you measured the space between the road wheels?


Yes. Each spacing was different. None were the same.


I'm sure there were slight differences (obviously there was the larger gap between the first and second road wheels), but do you have an approximate average size? 1" - 2" - 3", there has been considerable discussion about how close together the road wheels look on the kit, compared to the real thing, but nobody had a measurement on the actual tank.


I don't remember how the head of the restoration shop there phrased it, but the roadwheel spacing is irrelevant. What is important is the distance between torsion-bar arms. The wheel spacing had an average of about 3.75 inches with the standard deviation of about 0.5 inches. Min was around an inch, and the max was about 5. It was very tight in some cases and very distant in others. (Sorry for the statistician in me coming out.) The factors contributing to this where the different vehicle weights, tire wear, and years of sitting idle. I'll do what I can to find out more, but no promises on info anytime soon. Classes resume in a few days... So goodbye freetime until May.


I am in the midst of building a Takom T30 and have been digging through my references for information. I believe I found an answer to the wheel spacing question. There was an APG report on the testing of the pilot tanks T29 and T30. The excerpt I have is undated but the table of component failures has dates from 10/47 to 12/49, so it is likely from 1950.

The "bogie" spacing (*), front to rear, is given as:

Right - 36, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29 inches
Left - 32, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29 inches
Return rollers - 28-3/8, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29, 29 inches

These numbers apply to both the T29 and T30.

(*) These are entries on a standard form and were undoubtedly taken from a general arrangement drawing showing wheel spacing.

Looking at the pictures of the tanks before the moved to FT Benning, you can see that even then a number of the wheels were missing all their rubber. This will certainly affect the center-to-center spacing.



KL
KurtLaughlin
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Pennsylvania, United States
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
Armorama: 2,377 posts
Posted: Thursday, May 30, 2019 - 04:50 PM UTC
I've trued up all 36 wheels on my Takom T30 and have just measured them. All were greater than .736 (25.75) and less than .750 (26.25) inches in diameter, so they are within reasonable size limits.

I like the idea of the track jig Takom has provided, but they don't tell you where the locating pins fit on the rigid lengths. Very difficult to figure out.

KL
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