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General Ship Modeling
Discuss modeling techniques, experiences, and ship modeling in general.
Build blog for Heller's HMS Victory
timmyp
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Posted: Friday, August 14, 2020 - 01:06 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Timmy, that is some intricate, beautiful work. As always, I stand in awe of someone willing and able to take on a complex project such as this. Keep up the good work!



Thanks, Mr. Reynaga! I find that the more complex a thing is, the more enthused I am.

Currently, I'm hesitant to do any work on her, as I'm deathly afraid of knocking something off of her!

TimReynaga
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MODEL SHIPWRIGHTS
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Posted: Thursday, August 13, 2020 - 04:05 AM UTC
Timmy, that is some intricate, beautiful work. As always, I stand in awe of someone willing and able to take on a complex project such as this. Keep up the good work!
timmyp
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Posted: Wednesday, August 12, 2020 - 05:56 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Timothy,

You don't want any masts turning on you while installing all that rigging, it could really screw up the works.



Absolutely!


Quoted Text

Nice progress. Is that ratline suppose to be twisted I see in one of the photos?

Mark



Thanks, Mark. No, that ratline shouldn't be so twisted; currently I don't have any of the ratlines secured on either the fore or main masts; the twist you see, I'm hoping it will get straightened out a bit once I secure the ratlines.

Thanks for looking in!

Tim
d6mst0
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Posted: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 - 11:20 PM UTC
Timothy,

You don't want any masts turning on you while installing all that rigging, it could really screw up the works.

Nice progress. Is that ratline suppose to be twisted I see in one of the photos?

Mark
timmyp
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Posted: Tuesday, August 11, 2020 - 11:48 AM UTC
Well, it's been longer than a day or two, but I'm finally ready to post! I guess I'll start with a pic of the main yard glued in place:
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So getting the main yard in place, led me to do the rigging for the main yard lifts:

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In the previous photos, you might have noticed a black thread going around the main yard, right about at its center. This is a sling that the main and fore yards get. In Heller's instructions, it says to use 0.6mm thread (but then, just about every thread that starts with an "E" is supposed to be 0.6 mm). So I used some 0.53 mm thread I have, but it absolutely looks too thin for its purpose. I found a reference that said to use 1.3mm thread (plenty beefy!), but cheapskate that I am, I'm not going to run out to the store and start looking for some 1.3 mm thread - I'll just yank the current thread out, and trying using my 0.75 mm thread to make it look a bit better. Here's a couple of pics of the sling. One thing to note, is that the sling goes through the small square opening in the top; when I first test-fitted the thread, I had pulled each side up through the larger openings on the side of top:

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This is the sling, going over the top of the mastcap:

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One reason I put the main yard in now, and especially before installing the main top sail, was just so I would have some space to manipulate the lift blocks and such. So with the main yard in place, I went back and installed the topgallant sheet lines. Now, in Heller's instructions, it shows the sheet lines being attached to a "kevel" towards the rear of the mast. In looking at this, I got to wondering if the sheet line went through the main top, then to its belay point, or did it go outside the main top, and then to its belay. Well, in checking Longridge's book, it shows the sheet line belaying to the first pine on the fife rail against the hull; it further shows that the kevels are used for some different lines.

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I thought this over the past week, as to where to belay that sheet line. In the end, I decided to go with what Heller has, as I'm pretty much building this out of the box.

There's also a problem with main mast, in that it never did seat correctly against the hull. So now, I have a main mast that rotates! I got to thinking about what I could use to slide between the mast and the hole in the deck to secure the mast; I came up with the idea of planing some thin strips of styrene off of one of the sprues. In the next picture, these are the strips as they came off the plane; the second picture shows one of the strips uncurled and pulled out straight:

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Here's a construction tip: in the assembly of the fore and main masts, it shows in the instructions that part 37 goes at the very upper end of the middle segment of the mast. However, if you install parts 37 at that point, you won't be able to fit the trestletree over them (at least, I don't think you will). So the tip here is, put the mast together, and glue those parts 37 into place as one of the last things you do on the mast.

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For what it's worth, those parts 37 are incorrectly placed on the mainmast, but correctly placed on the foremast.

And lastly, how the topgallant sheet lines got installed. I previously had put a "helper" thread through the kevel, knowing that if I didn't, I'd have the hardest of times trying to push the actual sheetline through there. So here's a pic of sheet line & helper thread glue together (the sheetline is on the left, the help to the right).

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Surprisingly, once I started to get the sheetline in place and everything, the first one I did (port side) was a big harder to do than the starboard side. So here's some pix of the sheetlines installed. The only problem is, with those sheetlines in the direction that they are, it's going to be tougher to install further rigging.

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So now, I guess I can install the main top sail, rig it, and then install the foretopgallant sail and foretop sail. I think, right now, I'm going to leave the fore and main sails for later.

Thanks again to all for taking a look, and I hope everyone is healthy!

Tim
timmyp
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Posted: Monday, August 03, 2020 - 02:00 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Tim,

to me it clearly appears you would have more than four hands... And don't ask my for advise on your threads, I'm just watching with awe and following how you work and fight through all this. Great to see progress and that you are, step by step, getting there!

Cheers
Jan



Hi Jan,

Hope all is well with you.

WRT hands, maybe I can enlist one of the Indian gods - you know, one with 20 arms - to help out!

I abandoned the use of the hemp string I bought. I did put a small length of the stuff in some water for an hour or two, and it made it quite pliable. But when it dried, it seemed to have a stiffness that I wasn't happy with. So I used some thread that I had in my spares/leftovers box for rigging the main yard lift. I think I'll use that hemp string for the sheet lines on the main and fore sails.

The biggest "fighting" I do now, is to avoid knocking something off the ship, when trying to add some rigging!

My next post, in a day or two, will be some photos of the main yard lift & stuff. Stay tuned!

Tim
JJ1973
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Posted: Thursday, July 30, 2020 - 09:40 AM UTC
Hi Tim,

to me it clearly appears you would have more than four hands... And don't ask my for advise on your threads, I'm just watching with awe and following how you work and fight through all this. Great to see progress and that you are, step by step, getting there!

Cheers
Jan
timmyp
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Posted: Sunday, July 12, 2020 - 08:57 PM UTC
Only four hands??
d6mst0
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Posted: Sunday, July 12, 2020 - 10:40 AM UTC
Timothy,

Looking good. Would be nice to have four hands once in awhile. I know I would could use them at times.

Mark
timmyp
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Posted: Sunday, July 12, 2020 - 04:22 AM UTC
Duh! Forgot to add the last picture:

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timmyp
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Posted: Sunday, July 12, 2020 - 04:20 AM UTC
Well, Mark, here's how it looks on the bench. The first picture is how the starboard side block turned out:

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And here's how the port side block was set-up, after I (hopefully) got it glued in to place:

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And this is the port side block, with some line rove through it.
The line is 0.5 mm hemp thread; I wanted to use something beefier than just sewing thread for this rigging. But I'm curious: if I soak this hemp thread in water for a while, to try and make it a bit more pliable, would it cause the thread to swell up? Because if it swells up too much, I won't be able to get the thread through the sheave holes. Any ideas? Thanks!

Tim
d6mst0
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Posted: Thursday, July 02, 2020 - 07:16 AM UTC
Sounds like a good plan. Let us know how it came out.

Mark
timmyp
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Posted: Thursday, July 02, 2020 - 03:10 AM UTC
So I did a test fit of the main yard, trying to get a feel for how long the thread should be for the main yard lift. This is rigged differently from most of the other yards on the ship; it's a couple of big blocks that have multiple sheaves on them, so it's very much an industrial-looking set-up. What I discovered, though, is that with the lower block (the one attached to the yard) not being fixed in a definite direction, the rigging got twisted (see the photo). So my cure (which I haven't put into action yet) is put the blocks on the yardarm under some tension (so that they "stand up") and then glue them in place. I hope it works!

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timmyp
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Posted: Tuesday, June 16, 2020 - 11:37 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Tim,

just looking on all your rigging and the explanations with awe and I know I couldn't do it!! The way you are getting into all of this and how you are building it leaves the impression that it actually could work right there on your model!

I'm just amazed!

Cheers
Jan



Thanks, Jan.

And yes, some of that rigging actually works! In the photo in the previous post, you'll note that the sail is curved backwards and a bit upwards...this happened when I was tying the clue line off to the fife rail - I didn't realize I was pulling so hard on the thread, it actually caused the sail to start being pulled upwards!

Anyways, glad you stopped by and took a look. I hope you're doing well, what with all covid-19 things going on.

Cheers,

Tim
JJ1973
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Posted: Saturday, June 13, 2020 - 05:44 AM UTC
Tim,

just looking on all your rigging and the explanations with awe and I know I couldn't do it!! The way you are getting into all of this and how you are building it leaves the impression that it actually could work right there on your model!

I'm just amazed!

Cheers
Jan
timmyp
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Posted: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 - 03:17 AM UTC
So when I was installing what is called the tye line, in my first attempt at running the line through the correct pulley, I managed to run it through the hole made by a buntline pulley attachment, which is attached to a large double block on the yardarm. In the picture, the yellow circle is where I managed to initially push the thread through (now, if I had actually wanted the thread to go through there, I'd probably still be working on that!). In order to keep the bunline pullies out of the way, I used some spare thread and a clothespin to pull them out of the way. Once I did that, it was easier to see what I was doing. In the picture, the light blue line is one of the tye lines

In attaching the tye line to the mast, Heller vaguely indicates it is attached to the trestletree, but in looking at Longridge's book, the tye line actually is tied to the mast, just above where all the shrouds go around the mast, and that's where the tye lines got attached (and where it "starts" - the other end ending at the fife rail).

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timmyp
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Posted: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 - 02:51 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Timothy,

Well that sucks having to the assembly twice. Those buntline pulleys do look out of place. Good luck with the move.

Mark



Hi Mark,

Well, in a case of leaving sleeping dogs lie, I'm not going to try and move those pullies - I'd probably do more damage than good. I guess it'll just be a lesson for future modelers to learn. I'm not sure if I will have the same problem when I start to rig the foremast yards- but if I do, maybe I can salvage things on the foremast before assembly gets too far along.

Tim
d6mst0
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Posted: Monday, June 08, 2020 - 07:36 AM UTC
Timothy,

Well that sucks having to the assembly twice. Those buntline pulleys do look out of place. Good luck with the move.

Mark
timmyp
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Posted: Sunday, June 07, 2020 - 12:17 PM UTC
Heller strikes again:

The rebel stronghold has been vanquished by the Emperor's Deathst

Whoops! Wrong blog!

So what I found, is that Heller's instructions for placing of the buntline blocks and the lift blocks for the main top sail don't "work". In the photo below, which is from instruction 21, "Main Mast Composition Preparation" it clearly shows the lift & buntline blocks being installed above and below the section that gets painted black:

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This next image, from instruction 29, "Sails on the Main Mast", shows again the blocks in question are above and below the black-painted section of the mast; however, it shows the yardarm to be significantly below the blocks:

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However, when I installed the yardarm, I used the dimensions that are indicated in instruction 23, "Principles for fitting a mast", and using that dimension, it puts the yardarm right underneath the black painted section of the mast, and also immediately below the buntline blocks (and just to be sure, I re-measured the distance before I took all these pictures):

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So what this means is, I won't have a pair of lines coming from the yardarms up to the upper reaches of the main mast (which means the "ooooooh! aahhhhh!" factor will be lessened). So here's how I anticipate the buntline will flow:

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The dashed line means that the buntline is on the front of the sail.

So I guess, the tip here is, put all 4 blocks above the black painted part of the mast, or put the lift line blocks above the black painted section, and then put the buntline blocks above those blocks.

Next steps: I'm going to install the main topgallant tye rigging (lines V42 and V43) this week, and when that's done, I'll install the topgallant sail. Well, that's the plan, anyways.

Thanks for looking, and I hope no one has come down with Covid-19, and that everyone is weathering their stay-at-home guidelines. And of course, with social distancing, I would guess that leads to a lot of safe sex practices - unless you can "couple" from six feet away!
JannerKebab
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Posted: Tuesday, June 02, 2020 - 11:31 PM UTC
Hi Tim, that spreadsheet would be great.
timmyp
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Posted: Tuesday, June 02, 2020 - 11:03 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Thanks Tim, I have some doweling I can use. Iíve been going through the instructions, not the best in some places, I have a copy of the Imai plans for this kit, they are not in English but at least the cordage dimensions are in mm and are double the length of the other plans, will use both to build.



I have a spreadsheet that has scale dimensions for the diameter of the various rigging lines - it's pretty handy, but the trick is "translating" the names of the lines in the spreadsheet, to the actual line on the ship. Some are easy to figure out, some are not. Let me know if you'd like a copy of the spreadsheet.

And while you're waiting for the stuff from HiSmodel to arrive, I'd say go ahead and get started on the painting. There's a lot to paint! I think I've already gone through 3 or 4 jars of the insignia yellow, and at least 2 big jars of (Tamiya acrylic) flat black.

Cheers,

Tim
JannerKebab
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Posted: Monday, June 01, 2020 - 05:31 AM UTC
Thanks Tim, I have some doweling I can use. Iíve been going through the instructions, not the best in some places, I have a copy of the Imai plans for this kit, they are not in English but at least the cordage dimensions are in mm and are double the length of the other plans, will use both to build.
timmyp
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Posted: Monday, June 01, 2020 - 12:32 AM UTC
I didn't put any reinforcement on the mizzen mast, but the main & fore masts I put a wooden dowel on the inside. And that reinforcement only went in on the lower part of the masts, as they are two-part masts. The upper components of the masts are single-piece parts.
JannerKebab
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Posted: Friday, May 29, 2020 - 07:59 AM UTC
Iím going with the yellow ochre and red ochre as thatís not too bright. I ve also order the Amati cordage especially after seeing how much it takes to make the hammock netting and the shrouds. Will be starting in a few weeks but after following your build the first few months will be taken up by painting.

Did you reinforce the masts at all when you built them?
timmyp
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Posted: Friday, May 29, 2020 - 07:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Tim

The Kit cost £150

I am waiting for wooden deck veneers, standing rigging and the running rigging.

I may get the sails after Christmas, will wait and see.

I will be hand painting, I have purchased the paints they use in the part kit from the magazine dasgitino did, better yellow and red, I last went round Victory about 10 years ago, the humbrol yellow they recommend seems too bright.



Hi Lee,

Well, it looks like the price of the kit hasn't changed much over the years -if I did the math right, your price is only a little bit higher than the 160 USD I paid...over a decade ago!

I used Testor's "Insignia Yellow" on my Victory, and I think it's too bright. Perhaps a better color would something like yellow ochre.

Cheers,

Tim